Dec 5, 2024
In the latest episode of NASPA's SA Voices From the Field podcast, Dr. Jill Creighton sits down with Dr. Ainsley Carry, Vice President for Students at the University of British Columbia (UBC), to discuss the current state and future directions of student affairs. Their conversation ranges from the importance of listening to students and adapting to cultural nuances, to the evolving role of AI and mental health support on campus.
The Evolution of Student Affairs
A Shift from Traditional Theories
Dr. Ainsley Carry highlights that student affairs have undergone significant changes over the years. Historically, the field focused on career placement and leadership development, often driven by traditional theories like those proposed by Tinto and Chickering. However, Dr. Carry critiques these models for being outdated and restrictive. He argues for the necessity of freeing student affairs from these old theoretical constraints to better align with the evolving needs and cultures of modern students.
From Leadership to Inclusivity
The emphasis has gradually shifted from leadership, with its positional nature, to inclusivity in participation. Today's student affairs professionals recognize the importance of engaging students inside and outside the classroom, acknowledging the challenges in measuring qualitative learning experiences. According to Dr. Carry, the current trends in student affairs reflect a return to career exploration and identity development, rather than mere placement, recognizing the global nature of modern careers and the importance of early engagement through internships.
Listening and Feedback Sessions
Dr. Carry has introduced listening sessions at UBC, conducting over 100 sessions with thousands of student participants. These sessions are crucial for gathering feedback, understanding what works well, and identifying areas needing improvement. The methodology is simple but effective: asking students what’s working, what isn’t, what should be maintained, what should be stopped, and what other questions they have. This process ensures that student voices are heard and integrated into strategic planning.
Enhancing Mental Health Support
Reducing Wait Times and Expanding Access
Mental health support on campuses has seen substantial improvements, as Dr. Carry points out. Universities have reduced wait times for counseling and expanded access through both in-person and virtual formats. Regulatory changes now allow cross-state counseling, and a greater number of individuals are pursuing careers in counseling, contributing to a robust pool of professionals ready to support students.
Destigmatizing Mental Health Discussions
Efforts are ongoing to destigmatize mental health discussions. Dr. Carry emphasizes that addressing mental health proactively is central to supporting students’ overall well-being. Institutions are aiming to normalize these conversations, making it easier for students to seek help without fear of judgment.
The Promise of AI in Higher Education
24/7 Student Services
One of the most exciting topics Dr. Carry discusses is the potential of artificial intelligence (AI) in student affairs. Just as calculators once transformed education, AI has the potential to offer 24/7 student services. This could address the common mismatch between student needs and the traditional service hours of university offices. AI can provide continuous support for academic, career, and mental health advising, particularly during after-hours when human staff are unavailable.
Supplementing Human Interactions
It’s crucial to note that Dr. Carry views AI as a supplement, not a replacement, for human interactions. While AI can enhance the availability and efficiency of student services, the human touch remains irreplaceable. AI can manage routine inquiries and provide timely responses, leaving more complex and sensitive issues for human professionals to handle.
Navigating Cultural Differences in Higher Education
Adapting to the Canadian Context
Moving to Canada in 2019, Dr. Carry had to adapt to the Canadian higher education landscape, which differs significantly from the U.S. context. One prominent difference he observed was the less prominent role of Greek life and a lower incidence of binge drinking. Moreover, Canadian universities have a more balanced approach to college sports, and there’s a reduced concern about gun violence on campuses.
Emphasizing Health and Well-Being
In Canada, student health and well-being is a primary focus, especially considering the varying healthcare needs of international students. Dr. Carry underscores the importance of making career development resources accessible right from the first year and tackling affordability issues exacerbated by fluctuating international currencies.
A Future-Forward Approach to Student Affairs
Dr. Ainsley Carry's insights demonstrate a future-forward approach to student affairs, emphasizing the need to evolve with changing student demographics and cultural contexts. By integrating student feedback, enhancing mental health support, and leveraging AI, institutions can create more inclusive and supportive environments. As we look to the future, it’s clear that student affairs must continue to innovate and adapt, always keeping the well-being and success of students at its core.
As always, NASPA's SA Voices From the Field thanks its listeners for their support and encourages feedback, topic suggestions, and reviews to continue delivering content that matters.
TRANSCRIPT
Dr. Jill
Creighton [00:00:00]:
Welcome to Student Affairs Voices From the Field, the podcast where
we share your student affairs stories from fresh perspectives to
seasoned experts. Brought to you by NASPA, we curate free and
accessible professional development for higher ed pros wherever you
happen to be. This is season 11, the past, present, and future of
student affairs, and I'm doctor Jill Creighton, she, her, hers,
your essay voices from the field host. Today on Essay Voices, we
continue our journey with International Student Affairs
Professionals by welcoming doctor Ainsley Carry. Ainsley joined the
University of British Columbia on April 1st, 2019 as the vice
president, students. Ainsley has responsibility for a portfolio
that includes student health and wellness, center for student
involvement and careers, center for community engaged learning,
student housing and community services, and athletics and
recreation. He also oversees strategic priorities, such as the
university's well-being framework, sexual violence prevention and
response office, and anti racism initiatives. The vice president's
student's portfolio is responsible for a $300,000,000 budget,
including more than 25 100 full time employees and 1500 student
employees.
Dr. Jill
Creighton [00:01:05]:
Ainsley's responsibilities encompass undergraduate and graduate
students on the Vancouver and Okanagan campuses. Ainsley joins UBC
from the University of Southern California where he served as VPSA
from 2013 to 2019, and before that, Auburn University where he
served in the same position from 2009 through 2013. Ainsley held a
faculty role in the Rossier School of Education at USC and Auburn
University's College of Ed. His higher education career includes
stints at Temple University, the University of Arkansas, and
Southern Methodist University. He's a 3 time graduate of the
University of Florida where he earned his bachelor's degree,
master's in counseling, and doctorate in higher education
administration. Ainsley also earned an MBA from Auburn in 2011 and
a master of studies of law from the University of Southern
California in 20 19. Ainsley brings over 30 years of experience in
college administration. He led several institutional initiatives to
combat sexual violence on campus, prevent hazing, and respond to
campus protests.
Dr. Jill
Creighton [00:01:55]:
Yet Ainsley is most proud of his work to enhance the student
experience. Ainsley wrote, throughout my career, I've come to
realize that our greatest responsibility as academic leaders
includes the health, wellness, and safety of all students. Issues
of sexual misconduct, mental health, overconsumption of alcohol,
and equity are public health matters. When any of these experiences
negatively impact any student, their their learning experience is
severely compromised. We must tackle these challenges with the same
rigor to approach public health issues. Evidence based and
prevention focused, there's no reason why UBC cannot be the
healthiest campus in Canada. Ainslie begins his journey at UBC with
a mission to interact with students daily and build academic
partnerships outside the classroom. Ainsley, welcome to SA Voices
from the Field.
Dr. Ainsley
Carry [00:02:35]:
Jill. It's so good to be here today, and thank you for having
me.
Dr. Jill
Creighton [00:02:38]:
I always love getting the opportunity to talk to other student
affairs professionals who are global. And you have been both
domestically state side and are currently global. So I'm really
looking forward to digging into your wealth of experience on the
past, present, and future of student affairs, especially bringing
in that Canadian perspective. You're currently sitting in the VPSA
seat at UBC, University of British Columbia. And the first thing we
always love to do on our show is get to know you by asking you, how
did you land in your current seat?
Dr. Ainsley
Carry [00:03:06]:
So I'll go a little bit back. I went to school at the University of
Florida in Gainesville, and then I went there to play football. So
I was so much in love with the sport that that was my motivation
for going to university. But while I was there, I fell in love with
learning things. I realized that if I applied the skills that I
learned in my sport and applied those skills in the classroom that
I could learn anything that I wanted to. So slowly, my 3rd 4th
year, my attention drifted completely academics. And while I was
focused on academics, I had the chance to work with other students
who were still trying to figure out their learning strategies. And
that intrigued me so much that when I graduated from the
university, I first took my initial passion going to corporate
America and I went into retail and I hated that experience.
Dr. Ainsley
Carry [00:03:50]:
So it catapulted me back to the University of Florida. And I said,
you know what? I enjoyed, I enjoyed helping people learn and
helping them make meaning out of life. What degree program is that?
And someone guided me into college administration, higher ed
counseling with a student affairs focus. At the time, I didn't know
it. I didn't understand it, but I knew the people that were most
influential in my life were those Ired administrators, the deans of
students, the vice presidents for student affairs. I remember Tom
Hill was the dean of students at the University of Florida when I
was a student, and then he's been this incredible pillar of the
profession since then. So I earned my masters in higher
administration and my doctorate in college administration and
worked around the US at a number of different universities. Not
gonna recall maybe about 10 years ago sitting now with my family
and trying to imagine what's part of that future.
Dr. Ainsley
Carry [00:04:41]:
We wanted to have an international experience, we wanted to live
somewhere else in the world, drive on the other side of the road,
eat different food, develop completely different taste buds and
perhaps even learn a foreign language. We wanted our daughter to be
a global citizen and what would that look like? So we imagine all
these countries we might live in Singapore, Australia, China, Hong
Kong, like where the places in the world we wanted to go and if
that opportunity came up, we would say yes. So I received a call
from a recruiter at the University of British Columbia. So I
thought, woah, here's a great school in Great Britain, of course.
Well, when I went and did my homework on it, I realized British
Columbia is not in Great Britain. It's not even in Columbia. It's
in Vancouver, Canada. So I made the trip up here, took the
interview, fell in love with the environment, the people, and the
portfolio is amazing.
Dr. Ainsley
Carry [00:05:33]:
And I have a pleasure of working with an incredible group of
student affairs professionals. So my journey was about saying yes
to opportunities. That's how I ended up here at UBC beginning in
2019.
Dr. Jill
Creighton [00:05:44]:
You remind me a lot of my friend, doctor Rafael Alex Moffett. He
and I met when he was over in China and I succeeded him in a role
over overseas in China. And, I think all of us who have taken that
expat leap have that similar sense of adventure within us, but that
global citizenship value as definitely something core to our being
and and figuring out in the world. But I'm gonna say, Ainsley, you
do not wanna drive on the other side of the road. I've been in the
UK for about 6, 7 months now. I did drive for the first time. I
thought it might die the entire time, So maybe don't put that one
on the bucket list.
Dr. Ainsley
Carry [00:06:16]:
Gotcha. Good to know. Thank you.
Dr. Jill
Creighton [00:06:18]:
But you've been up at UBC for about 5 years now, riding it out
through the pandemic in a different cultural context than the one
that you come from, especially after having led in the US for so
long. Can you talk to us about the first things that struck you as
different in the Canadian higher ed context from maybe what you
were expecting given your US training?
Dr. Ainsley
Carry [00:06:37]:
Yeah. And I'll go pre pandemic. Prior to coming to UBC in
Vancouver, I served as a vice president for students at Auburn
University in Alabama. Enjoyed that Southeastern Conference. I'm an
SCC graduate, so it was great to be in the conference and and be
part of the energy and the atmosphere working and living in the
SCC. And then after Auburn, I became the vice president for
students at the University of Southern California at Los Angeles.
Also, a major institution, major college athletics, big Greek life,
donors and alumni support was incredible there. Just really great
solid institutions.
Dr. Ainsley
Carry [00:07:11]:
I came over the border north to Canada in 2019 and began my service
as vice president for students here. So this was my 3rd vice
presidency and I committed myself to arriving here and completely
embedding myself in the new culture, listening, not making
assumptions, suspending judgment about anything and really become a
student of the environment. Like, let me learn it before I make any
preconceived notions or make the mistake of copying what I learned
somewhere else and attempting to paste it in a brand new culture.
So I listened for my entire 1st year and learned so much and just
have a great appreciation for the slight nuances and higher ed
administration in Canada. Here's what popped out of me within my
1st year. At the end of the 1st year, some things were
significantly different in my role as vice president. One, for
example, I spent a lot of time at my prior institutions concerned
with regard to issues of overconsumption of a binge drinking
culture. So when there was Greek life and college athletics and big
game days, alcohol was a part of the culture, and not a casual
drinking way, in a binge drinking way.
Dr. Ainsley
Carry [00:08:21]:
So my Saturday nights or Sunday mornings were consumed with
responding to what happened the football game before. And sometimes
that was an incredible drain on the student affairs team because we
were responding at night to issues related to overconsumption of
alcohol and students being transported to the hospitals. That had
not been my experience in Canada. Canada is much more casual
drinkers, so they consume alcohol, some may over consume, but the
notion of drinking an entire bottle of vodka and 30 minutes is not
an activity here that I've seen in my experience. So that
completely changed the rhythm of my life, what the weekends meant.
Greek life is a different culture here. It's not as prominent. It
does not rule over decision making at the university in ways that
it had at some schools in the states.
Dr. Ainsley
Carry [00:09:09]:
So completely different culture. I didn't have to be concerned as
much about issues of gun violence on campus. In previous
institutions, I recall legislation work making its way through the
state legislature about whether students should be able to carry
firearms on campus. That is not a question that's coming up here in
any Canadian context. The obsession with college sports, there's a
healthy balance of the need for our teams to be successful and win,
but there's a greater balance on those students being students
before their athletes. And there is this overwhelming obsession
with college football, college hockey, you name it. So it's an
incredibly balanced environment with regard to those things. The
last thing that I noticed, the diversity here was different.
Dr. Ainsley
Carry [00:09:58]:
The diversity at UBC is a global diversity. Students coming from
countries all over the world make up our international student
population. In the US, it was largely black or Hispanic or
different US cultures with a spattering of international students
here. It's almost a complete blend of all of those cultures. So
those were some of the things that I noticed that were
distinctively different in Canada, and I can imagine different
places in in the world may have some things that are different.
What some of the things that were the same concerns about sexual
violence also happening here, concerns related to mental health and
students also happening here and how the administration supports
that, issues of affordability, especially around housing and food,
they are present here. So we have some of the same concerns, but
many of the things that would consume the time of the vice
president, I found to be less consuming here, quite less
consuming.
Dr. Jill
Creighton [00:10:55]:
And then looking at that alternatively, then what do you focus on
most in the Canadian context as a bpsa
Dr. Ainsley
Carry [00:11:02]:
student health and well-being is number 1. My 1st year, I spent
that entire year hosting student listening sessions, small groups
of 25 students. Sometimes I'd buy pizza for 400 students, and
they'd show up in an auditorium and we would just talk. And I'd ask
those students 5 questions. What's working? It's not working. What
must we continue doing? What must we stop doing? And what question
am I not asking you that you wish you I would ask and you wanted to
provide an answer? And we did about 20 listening sessions with over
500 students in that 1st year. And the primary issues that came up
navigating student healthcare was number 1. Our students were
coming from all over the world and their healthcare systems were
different than the healthcare that they were trying to navigate for
the first time as an 18 or 19 year old 1st year student.
Dr. Ainsley
Carry [00:11:53]:
They were away from their parents and they were making their own
health related decisions and we didn't make it easy for them. We
had multiple health center operations and students had to identify
which one to go to in between classes and then they would find
themselves at the wrong one and then they had to take another day
to make another appointment to go to the other wrong place and by
that time their health condition may have worsened or it may have
resolved itself but we also found students who just said you know
what it's too complicated I'll just wait till I go home And as you
can imagine with health related issues, they don't get better as
time goes along. You actually have to get them treated or get them
responded to. So the first thing we worked on was fixing or making
it easier for students to navigate health care. The second major
concern that students raise were issues related to career
development. So many students arrived on campus, had a great first
and second year, then kinda woke up that 3rd year and realized, I
wish I knew about this internship in my 1st year. I I would have
taken advantage of it and I would be more prepared. Again, we
didn't make it easy for students to navigate their career
journey.
Dr. Ainsley
Carry [00:12:59]:
We didn't make it clear. We didn't make it structurally
unavoidable. So we had to find ways to make a smarter process for
that. And then the 3rd major issue here are issues of
affordability. Now that we've navigated health care, we are
building out our career development process. The thing that has
bubbled to the top are issues related to affordability. We have a
large international student community with the Canadian dollar is
different than the dollar from their international country. We have
geopolitical conflicts going on impacting individuals' ability to
continue to study, natural disasters happening, so issues of
affordability, housing and food are prominent on the list.
Dr. Ainsley
Carry [00:13:39]:
At UBC, it's not unique to Canada, this is a global impact on
student learning right now and it's really impacting their mental
health and impacting everything else. So all of those things
combined, student health and well-being is our number one
priority.
Dr. Jill
Creighton [00:13:56]:
I wanna reflect back on those 5 questions you've been asking the
students in the listening sessions. I feel those are really great
open ended questions that really anyone in student affairs,
regardless of the level that you're working at in an organization,
can use to begin some light assessment on how your your services
are functioning or how your programs and impacts are really kind of
setting with the students. So can you please repeat those for
Dr. Ainsley
Carry [00:14:20]:
us? Sure. So I begin with letting the students know today, here are
5 questions that I will pose to the group. You don't have to answer
all of them. You may choose 1. You may choose 2, but don't feel
compelled to answer all of them. What I wanna know and this is
while students are enjoying their pizza and getting ready for the
session. What I wanna know is, number 1, what's working for you?
What what are we doing a great job of? And you wanna say, dear
university, thank you for putting this in place. We need that
feedback.
Dr. Ainsley
Carry [00:14:53]:
Number 2, what's not working? Kind of the opposite side of the
first question. There's something that we've put in place that we
think is a good thing, but it's not working for students. Or there
may be a policy in place that's completely outdated, was designed
in the eighties or the nineties, and it no longer makes sense to
the student population who's here right now, so what's not working?
Number 3, what is the one thing you want us to maintain? Sometimes
students hear concerns about something that's gonna discontinue or
we're gonna stop doing something. What's the one thing that we have
to keep in place that students say this event, this tradition, this
ceremony, this activity is so precious to us. We really want this
to stay in place. The 4th question is if you had to pick one thing
that you want us to absolutely stop doing this, it's related to the
first two questions, but what's the thing that you want us to stop
doing? And then the 5th question is, what's the question you wish
the administration would ask you, but we have not asked you and you
wanted to tell us about? So we outline those 5 questions, we keep
them on poster boards nearby and I say, pick 1 or answer all 5.
It's up to you. But don't feel compelled to answer all 5.
Dr. Ainsley
Carry [00:16:06]:
Typically, students will stand up and say, let me tell you
something that's working. And then they say, to be fair, let me
also examine with you. Here's something I'm really bothered by. In
a few cases, students have stood up and said, here's a question
that I wish the administration would ask us more because I wanna
hear the answer. And most recently, that question came up about how
are we supporting students who are single parents, category that we
had not wrapped our minds on. We thought about families, but we
hadn't wrapped our mind around the complications of single parents.
So we have done 100 of listening sessions now over the past 5 plus
years that I've been here. 1,000 of students have participated and
we have a note taker there that collects notes.
Dr. Ainsley
Carry [00:16:54]:
And then we summarize all of those notes, produce a report and then
share it with the audience that came. We do our best to answer each
of the questions and this feedback session is what has helped us
produce our strategic plans.
Dr. Jill
Creighton [00:17:07]:
This is a great present practice. I think a lot of people should be
incorporating the student voice into their student affairs
strategic plans a little more. But I'm also wondering how you
navigate when you know that there's something that a student needs,
but your teams simply don't have the bandwidth, the resources, or
the foci to navigate that particular need.
Dr. Ainsley
Carry [00:17:24]:
Yeah. That's a good question. So we make it clear at the beginning
that this is a listening session. So I'm not always there to solve
the particular issue immediate. So sometimes students bring to the
stage a very personal issue with regard to men their own mental
health issues of sexual violence that I often ask to pause. And we
do have counselors that are there with us. I asked the student if
we could take this personal issue offline so that we can help them
solve their issue directly. And we'll take that student's name,
that student's phone number, sometimes we'll have a counselor who
continues the conversation with them, but we make sure that we help
address that individual student and their need.
Dr. Ainsley
Carry [00:18:06]:
As you said, sometimes there's an issue that we cannot resolve,
whether it's a geopolitical conflict, students have come to these
listening sessions and said, we want the university to demand a
ceasefire right now, why won't you demand a ceasefire? And we find
ourselves in this kind of, well, that's not within our capacity to
resolve that right now, but we understand your concern. Let us
understand at the depth of that concern, what is the thing that we
can do on campus? So sometimes we play it out with students in the
audience. What's the alternative for us to address geopolitical
concerns among our campus community. But for the most part, we have
found students with an individual concern is real tricky when we
pull them aside and have a 1 on 1 with them, we can help them
resolve that problem. If it's within the scope of the universe, it
might be outside of the portfolio of the vice president for
students. But our work is to advocate for students wherever it's
happening. So if it's in an academic function, we'll work with the
dean or the associate dean of that academic function. If it's in
housing or dining or in the community, we will help the students
navigate it.
Dr. Ainsley
Carry [00:19:11]:
So thus far, we've been mostly in the ballpark of issues that we
can respond to as a university, not just VP for students, but as a
university.
Dr. Jill
Creighton [00:19:22]:
When I think about transitioning into a new cultural context, which
I've done a couple of times in the last couple of years myself, I
always think about those things that caught me off guard that I
didn't realize would be a cultural norm or cultural assumption or
something I was carrying with me from my past that maybe I stepped
in something else in the context that I'm currently living in. So
I'm wondering if you can talk a little bit about how you've learned
to navigate cultural difference, especially in the Canadian context
where I think a lot of Americans tend to operate with a sense of
hubris that the cultures are more aligned than they really are. So
how have you figured out what to take with you from your American
core and what to approach with that most humility and and kind of
fix it when you have stepped in it?
Dr. Ainsley
Carry [00:20:03]:
That's such a great question. I think that is the most important
transition as anyone considering, global opportunities or working
outside of the United States. It's so easily to be immersed in the
American way of doing things. And it's so easy to assume that this
is the correct way. I spent my 1st year suspending all judgment,
allowing my values to be challenged, but focused on asking myself
the question, focused on being a critical thinker of the experience
and just absorbing this experience. And it wasn't a foreign idea to
me. I'd worked at Temple University in Philadelphia, the University
of Arkansas in Fayetteville, Auburn University in Alabama, the
University of Southern California. And even in those environments,
they were all US environments, but they were completely different
environments.
Dr. Ainsley
Carry [00:20:54]:
An attempt to copy and paste anything from Auburn to USC was not
gonna work. So I learned early in my US transitions from
institution to institution to pay attention to the unique culture
of the place that I'm sitting right now, like, be completely
present. I think the biggest mistake we can make is to copy and
paste or the worst phrase that I typically hear is when I was at
Auburn, we used to do like that does not work. So completely embed
yourself in your current institution and take the time. Sometimes
it's a year to completely learn the culture and values and why
things are done a certain way. In the end, you may disagree, you
may continue to disagree with the path or it may confirm that this
is the right path. And now I understand why we use this term or
participate in this practice. You might disagree with it in the
end, but it's hard to change when the community that you're trying
to change does not believe you understand their cultural
practice.
Dr. Ainsley
Carry [00:21:59]:
We have to build some social capital before we can jump directly
into change management. And I think that's true moving from
Colorado to California to Texas as it is moving from Los Angeles to
Vancouver, British Columbia. So immerse yourself in the culture,
understand what's going on, feel free to disagree in the end, but
you can't disagree until you understand. So it was being a critical
practitioner that has been most helpful for me. Give you an example
of one thing that came up. I am in my US mindset, very linear in
thinking about, let's solve this problem. So we'll come to the
table. There's a student issue.
Dr. Ainsley
Carry [00:22:40]:
We're grappling with something, but everyone is talking around the
something. So I'm sitting there listening, trying to figure out
what problem are we trying to solve? What is the issue here? And
after 30 or so minutes into the meeting, I grow so impatient that I
just say, wait a minute. What are we talking about? What is the
issue? I don't understand. What are we trying to solve? And then we
kinda continue to have this talk around it ness, and it's sometimes
an issue of culture or race. We have a large indigenous population
and indigenous commitment here, issues of black student issues,
religious and cultural issues. We have this merry-go-round for
about an hour that used to frustrate me. And I realized after my
1st year that I needed to slow down. I was the one that was moving
too fast.
Dr. Ainsley
Carry [00:23:28]:
Part of the process was the group coming to terms with finding the
right language to get there. So my impatience with problem solving
was my error, not the error of the group that I was sitting around
trying to navigate this with. So in my 1st year, I realized that
sometimes it's gonna take 3 meetings to get to the heart of the
issue, and I needed to be patient with that because the journey was
part of the problem solving, not pinpointing the issue and tackling
it immediately. So that was one of the nuances that I found here.
There's a lot of talk around an issue before we get to the meat of
the issue. And that's been a valuable learning lesson for me.
Dr. Jill
Creighton [00:24:09]:
Processing is part of the process. Yes. When you think about your
space that you're currently occupying and the staff that you are
responsible for leading and ultimately developing, what are you
doing differently in the Canadian context than you might have done
in the US context?
Dr. Ainsley
Carry [00:24:24]:
So one of the things that I have not been able to drag across the
border, some of the higher ed language that we had been developing
in the US since the 19 fifties sixties seventies as the profession
was being born, up student outcomes, strategic planning, learning
and assessment and evaluation and experiential learning, high
impact practices, all of the things that we've gone to conferences
to learn and adopt. Some of those things are unique, uniquely US.
And And when you come across the border, some of that language
changes. Those activities are still important, but the language of
those activities have changed. So you won't find, at least at my
institution, you won't find a lot of individuals who are
classically trained in higher aid administration, meaning earning a
master's degree in student affairs or a doctorate in college
administration. They are well educated, great experiences. But I
have degrees from chemistry and physics and math and business. And
they're all over the place.
Dr. Ainsley
Carry [00:25:23]:
Very few people are student affairs practitioners as we know them
in the U. S. So some of the language translation is different. And
it's been helpful for me to learn this language. What's important
here? Because after we talk it out for a while, then people will
say, oh, I know what you mean. This is what you're trying to say.
So it's been super helpful learning a new language, but it requires
listening. It really requires listening and taking our time to get
there.
Dr. Ainsley
Carry [00:25:52]:
I have found that our culture as an administration has been super
receptive to thinking outside the box, creating new ideas because
they're not boxed into Tinto's theory or Chickering's vectors or
any of the other theories that we learned as young student affairs
professionals that later on, when we go into another environment,
those theories sometimes have boxed us in because those theories
are largely out of date in many contexts. They have not evolved to
the new cultures of our students. So being able to free myself from
the boxes of student learning theories that we had adopted a long
time ago in a different context has been helpful for me to have
that learning experience because we're talking about the same
things and the same outcomes. But I had to learn how to how to drop
that language in those boxes.
Dr. Jill
Creighton [00:26:41]:
Well, Aynle, I'm gonna transition us over to our theme based
questions for the season. And so I have, one question for you on
the past, one on the present, and one in the future of student
affairs. So starting in the past, what's one component of the
history of the student affairs profession that you think we should
continue to carry forward or alternatively let go of?
Dr. Ainsley
Carry [00:26:59]:
So our higher ed profession, I recall when it was very focused on
career placement, career development. As time has moved on, I
remember when we introduced student leadership development, where
leadership was important and then we started to step away from
leadership development because it was so positional and that was a
distraction to those who said, I'm not a leader, but I wanna
participate. We weren't teaching followership anymore. We weren't
teaching good practice of being good teammates, working together.
So we moved away from leadership development. And then we kind of
completely focused on student learning, what are students learning
inside and outside the classroom. And that had an incredible amount
of value as we started to see both this learning happening in both
places. But we remain challenged with how do we measure learning
that's happening outside the classroom because so much of it is
qualitative, not quantitative.
Dr. Ainsley
Carry [00:27:55]:
Student experiences were just as important. I do think we're seeing
a revisit, a new world of student career development that is
different than when we attended school in the eighties nineties. It
was a very placement feel where employers came to campus to
interview you. Now we're in a world where students are global
employees. Students can work all over the world. Platforms like
Zoom and artificial intelligence are platforms that we should be
thinking about as students to help students make their career
decisions and pursue their career journey. So now I think it's not
just about career placement and career development, but it's about
career exploration and identifying self and seeing where you wanna
work as part of a global society. And we know students will
graduate from universities and within their first five or so years,
they will have 5 or 6 different jobs and employment
opportunities.
Dr. Ainsley
Carry [00:28:55]:
Unlike the prior generation that we went into a single industry,
and we know students are much more purpose driven about where they
work today. They want to be a part of a company that they feel good
about, that they feel this company is doing something better for
the world. How do we help students explore that journey? Now I have
students who arrive at the university who are looking for an
internship immediately. They want that 1st summer to begin their
career journey. Employers are using the internship as interview
number 1. So the student who has spent 4 years with a particular
company, number 1, knows more about that company than any place
else, and that employer knows about them. So the career offer is
easier at that point, but we have to start that journey earlier as
a part of a journey and not make it a super stressful situation for
a student who can't find that opportunity. But I think career
exploration and identity development is coming back.
Dr. Ainsley
Carry [00:29:57]:
That's a practice that I think was in the past in a very career
placement like way. And now we are entering this career journey
phase.
Dr. Jill
Creighton [00:30:07]:
Moving towards the present, what's happening in the field right now
that's going well for student affairs?
Dr. Ainsley
Carry [00:30:12]:
I think we're doing a much better job around issues of mental
health and how we're supporting students navigate mental health
care on campus. I remember the calls and the cries from more
counselors on campus. The wait time was too long. Sometimes
students were waiting 6 weeks for a counseling appointment, 8 weeks
for a counseling appointment. I believe our counseling systems have
become much more smarter. We now know how to triage critical
situations, get the student with the urgent care needs in first. We
have expanded our counseling portfolios to have not only counselors
on the ground, but COVID taught us that we could also deliver
mental health counseling via phone, via video, via Zoom. So now we
have virtual platforms for counseling and companies that provide
that virtual counselling.
Dr. Ainsley
Carry [00:31:05]:
I recall in the states, we were limited by which state we were in
and our ability to use a counselor in another state, that counselor
needed to be licensed in a particular state. Now, many of those
licensure agreements are giving way to allow students at your
university to have access to mental health counseling, whether it's
in state or out of state. And since then, so many more young adults
have graduated from universities, gone into counseling. So now we
have a much more robust pool of mental health counselors available.
I believe because of the demand, we're seeing more individuals go
into counseling. So I am proud today that we at University of
British Columbia have five paths that a student can receive mental
health counseling support. That's on the ground, virtually via
Zoom, by phone, we have embedded counselors into academic units and
we have embedded counselors into residence halls. So right now, the
wait time, if a student is willing to use the full menu is 72
hours, which is and a student who has urgent needs can be seen
immediately.
Dr. Ainsley
Carry [00:32:15]:
So the thing that I'm proudest of is the work that universities
have done to create a more robust student health and well-being
infrastructure, specifically around mental health counseling
services. And the stigma of it is being released. We can talk
openly about everyone having a relationship with a counselor as a
support mechanism, something that all students need, and it's not
frowned upon as as it had been in the past. So I am excited about
the world that we're living in. I have a 17 year old daughter
that's getting ready to go to a university, and I like the place
that we are right now.
Dr. Jill
Creighton [00:32:52]:
And looking outwards, in an ideal world, what does the field need
to be doing right now to thrive towards our future?
Dr. Ainsley
Carry [00:32:58]:
I think one of the most obvious answers around our future
conversation is how do we leverage artificial intelligence? There's
a robust conversation going on in the classroom about the
implications of AI. Much of it is around how students might use AI
to gain an advantage in the classroom. There's concern about AI
being used as a tool to cheat on exams. I I think the academics
will resolve that and pedagogy will adjust in order to it's like
when the calculator came on, Bill. People were concerned, oh,
students aren't gonna do math in their head anymore. Well, we
realized that the calculator can be a teaching tool, an
instructional tool. So how might we use AI as an instructional
tool? But I think there's a goal of mine in artificial intelligence
as we think about student affairs and student services. And the
reason why I'm so excited about it, many of our operations operate
on a 9 am to 5 pm schedule.
Dr. Ainsley
Carry [00:33:55]:
Okay. It might be 8 am to 5 pm, but that's not the student rhythm.
Students usually aren't up at 8 am looking for mental health
counseling services or academic advising or career advising that
may start at noon, but it's definitely not over at 5 pm. So that
student who it's midnight, they're concerned about something, they
wanna talk to someone, they wanna go through a resume, they have a
job interview the next day or a podcast interview, and they wanna
think through some questions. What if we had a suite of services
that were available 24 hours a day, 7 days a week? And and it
didn't have before we used to try to imagine how do we keep student
affairs personnel available for hours beyond 5 PM. And now I think
there's a world that we can use artificial intelligence to be more
available around the clock. Not that it would replace humans, but
it would be a supplement to the work that we're doing on the
ground. And then after 5 or 6 PM, we switch into a more virtual AI
mode that still helps students answer critical questions.
Dr. Ainsley
Carry [00:35:00]:
I remember we were trying to create avatars that would answer
questions and engage with students. And the technology was clumsy
back then. And this is 5 to 7 years ago when we were experimenting
with this at USC. I think artificial intelligence right now can
allow us to create much more smarter interfaces with students And
just imagine the possibilities. I'm talking academic advising,
career advising, advice on mental health counseling, advice on
interview preparation, everything that we do in student affairs, I
think there's an AI opportunity that we should explore and
vigorously vigorously consider. I don't think it will replace
humans, but I think it will be a great supplement.
Dr. Jill
Creighton [00:35:44]:
And if you're listening to essay voices for the first time today, I
strongly encourage you to go back a couple of weeks ago and listen
to the episode we did with doctor Daniel Weisglass all about AI in
higher education. It's time to take a quick break and toss it over
to producer Chris to learn what's going on in the NASPA world.
Dr.
Christopher Lewis [00:36:00]:
Thanks, Jill. So excited to be back in the NASPA world. And there's
a ton of things happening in NASPA. As we approach the end of the
year, there's no better time to reflect on your department's
achievements and plan for continuous improvement. A program review
collaborative review can provide the external insights needed to
refine your strategies and strengthen your programs. The PRC is a
collaborative effort between NASPA, the Association of Colleges and
Universities Housing Officers International, or ACUO AI, the
Association of College Unions International, ACUI, and NRSA,
Leaders in Collegiate Recreation. This partnership is designed to
provide best practice frameworks and expert guidance for
departmental evaluations. If this kind of evaluation sounds like
something that would really help your office, I encourage you to
check it out for yourself.
Dr.
Christopher Lewis [00:36:52]:
You can go to program review collaborative dot org to find out
more. The new issue of the Journal of College and Character has
just released. Volume 25 issue 4 just came out. And in this
journal, you're gonna be finding a ton of different articles.
Articles such as from Kent State to Black Lives Matter, student
affairs relationship with campus activism to developing character
through critical reflection or fraternities and sororities as civil
society organizations, past roles, present actions and future
possibilities. All of these articles and more can be found on the
NASPA website. When you go to the NASPA website, they're easy to
find. All you do is go to NASPA.org, go under publications, and you
can see all the journals right there.
Dr.
Christopher Lewis [00:37:39]:
The 2025 NASPA annual conference schedule has been released. You
can take a look at all of the things happening at the upcoming
NASPA 25 conference in March to be able to see all the different
programs that are going to be there and start putting together a
schedule for yourself. If you're planning to attend the NASPA
annual conference today, now is a great time to start planning your
schedule out so you know all of the different programs that you may
want to attend. I mentioned earlier this fall that the new class of
pillars of the profession have been named. And now is a great time
before the end of the year. If you have an interest in wanting to
make a donation to honor one of the 2025 Pillars of the Profession,
you can do so by going to the NASPA Foundation website to be able
to learn more about all of our 2025 Pillar of the Profession class.
And you can make a donation of any amount to support 1, 2, or all
of them. I highly encourage you to honor these individuals, putting
it by putting in a donation to be able to support them.
Dr.
Christopher Lewis [00:38:45]:
But also by doing that, you're also supporting the foundation,
which provides scholarships and more to support the work of NASPA.
Talking about the annual conference, one other conference that's
coming up. If you can't go to the annual in person conference, make
sure to set aside April 9th through 11th for the 2025 Virtual
Conference. The 2025 Virtual Conference is a 3 day interactive
educational experience for you as student affairs professionals or
anyone else that is a partner to higher education that will engage
you in high quality content centered around individual and team
growth. There will be multiple educational sessions, including
extended learning workshops that will allow for you and your teams
to participate in personal and professional development throughout
the live event and on demand. The nice thing is that by registering
for this conference, all of the sessions are available on demand
for 1 year. So even if you watch them once and you want to come
back and watch them again, you have the opportunity to do just
that. You can find out more on the learning portal of the NASPA
website.
Dr.
Christopher Lewis [00:39:55]:
You can go to learning.naspa.org and then go to the virtual
conference for more information. But while you're there, make sure
to check out all of the learning opportunities that are available
to you as a NASPA member. Every week, we're going to be sharing
some amazing things that are happening within the association. So
we are going to be able to try and keep you up to date on
everything that's happening and allow for you to be able to get
involved in different ways because the association is as strong as
its members. And for all of us, we have to find our place within
the association, whether it be getting involved with a knowledge
community, giving back within one of the the centers or the
divisions of the association. And as you're doing that, it's
important to be able to identify for yourself, where do you fit?
Where do you wanna give back? Each week, we're hoping that we will
share some things that might encourage you, might allow for you to
be able to get some ideas that will provide you with an opportunity
to be able to say, Hey, I see myself in that knowledge community. I
see myself doing something like that. Or encourage you in other
ways that allow for you to be able to think beyond what's available
right now, to offer other things to the association, to bring your
gifts, your talents to the association and to all of the members
within the association.
Dr.
Christopher Lewis [00:41:22]:
Because through doing that, all of us are stronger and the
association is better. Tune in again next week as we find out more
about what is happening in NASPA.
Dr. Jill
Creighton [00:41:33]:
Chris, it's always a pleasure to hear from you on what's going on
in and around NASPA. And Ainsley, we have reached our lightning
round. So I have 7 questions for you to answer in about 90 seconds.
Are you ready?
Dr. Ainsley
Carry [00:41:46]:
Let's do it.
Dr. Jill
Creighton [00:41:46]:
Okay. Question 1. If you were a conference keynote speaker, what
would your entrance music be?
Dr. Ainsley
Carry [00:41:51]:
Bring them out Bring them Out by TI.
Dr. Jill
Creighton [00:41:53]:
Number 2, when you were 5 years old, what did you wanna be when you
grew up?
Dr. Ainsley
Carry [00:41:56]:
I wanted to be a professional athlete.
Dr. Jill
Creighton [00:41:58]:
Number 3, who's your most influential professional mentor?
Dr. Ainsley
Carry [00:42:01]:
Barack Obama.
Dr. Jill
Creighton [00:42:02]:
Number 4, your essential student affairs read.
Dr. Ainsley
Carry [00:42:04]:
The next act, realigning your mindset, purpose, and career by Jason
Pena and Amy Hecht.
Dr. Jill
Creighton [00:42:11]:
Number 5, the best TV show you've binged lately.
Dr. Ainsley
Carry [00:42:13]:
Game of Thrones.
Dr. Jill
Creighton [00:42:15]:
Number 6, the podcast you've spent the most hours listening to in
the last year.
Dr. Ainsley
Carry [00:42:19]:
Pardon the interruption.
Dr. Jill
Creighton [00:42:20]:
And finally, number 7, any shout outs you'd like to give personal
or professional?
Dr. Ainsley
Carry [00:42:24]:
Let me give a shout out to I just mentioned them, Jason Pena and
Amy Heck. I believe they put out a great publication called the
next act realigned in your mindset, purpose, and career. And it's
all about the next step for college administrators like us. So I
think this is gonna be an exciting read, and I wanna encourage
everyone to go out and check it out.
Dr. Jill
Creighton [00:42:43]:
Ainsley, thank you so much for teaching us today about what's going
on in the UBC context and a little bit of the Canadian higher
education context. If anyone would like to learn from you after the
show airs, how can they find you?
Dr. Ainsley
Carry [00:42:54]:
Please email me atainsley.carry@ubc.ca. That's a ins
ley.carrycary@ubc.ca. And you can also hit me up on LinkedIn.
Dr. Jill
Creighton [00:43:10]:
Ainsley, thank you so much for sharing your voice with us
today.
Dr. Ainsley
Carry [00:43:13]:
Thank you, Jill, for having me. It was such a pleasure.
Dr. Jill
Creighton [00:43:20]:
This has been an episode of SA Voices from the Field brought to you
by NASPA. This show is made possible because of you, the listeners.
We continue to be grateful that you choose to spend your time with
us. If you'd like to reach the show, you can email us at
savoices@naspa.org
or find me on LinkedIn by searching for Dr. Jill l Creighton. We
welcome your feedback and your topic and guest suggestions. We'd
love it if you take a moment to tell a colleague about the show and
leave us a 5 star review on Apple Podcasts, Spotify, or wherever
you're listening now. It truly does help other student affairs pros
find the show and helps us to become more visible in the larger
podcasting community. This episode was produced and hosted by Dr.
Jill Creighton.
Dr. Jill
Creighton [00:43:58]:
That's me. Produced and audio engineered by Dr. Chris
Lewis. Special thanks to the University of Michigan
Flint for your support as we create this
project. Catch you next time.